TreeHugger.com: Another One Bites the Dust: University Closes Observatory, Evicts Famous Astronomer
Sven
· 1 year ago
I guess he should join the International Dark-Sky Association (darksky.org).
Bram
· 1 year ago
Most people have absolutely no idea how much light pollution is really out there. It takes a good old blackout to make it noticeable. Only then do you realise it and wonder about the stupidity of all that light going to waste.
Jag
· 1 year ago
95% OF TEACHER IN TORONTO UNIV ARE WHITE AND 85% OF STUDENTS ARE NON-WHITE, WOW who is to blame, the poor professor who came from india and got a job as a taxi driver or the white teacher club at Toronoto university. Well I am sure that taxi PHd professor became the powerful developer and bought out the university land.
Liam O'Brien
· 1 year ago
It's also worth noting that the observatory became less useful as the suburban wasteland swallowed it up and lit up the skies with street lamps and shopping malls.
weee recycling
· 1 year ago
It'll be interesting to follow this story and see where the money ends up being invested...
kaguvkov
· 1 year ago
This guy is an astronomer? If yes, then he should not waste his precious time sitting out there. He could join some associations that can take his talent to high level.
THE NADIR
· 1 year ago
THAT IS THE SADDEST PICTURE EVER
I remember when they "relocated" (removed) the observatory at Tulane University in New Orleans to expand the business school. People with money get away with such stupid things.
BlackGriffen
· 1 year ago
"Who knows, it may get too expensive and difficult to send their astronomers to Chile. "
Most of the astronomers I know telecommute for their observations. That's right, most of the time the telescope is being run by people who aren't on site. Granted, I would expect that there is an on site crew and the scientist herself would have to venture down if she wanted to install any custom equipment, but that's pretty rare.
At least that's the impression I get for the big telescopes. The smaller custom rigs (like VERITAS) are probably run slightly differently since they aren't quite as standardized as optical telescopes.
Carmell
· 1 year ago
Wow, what a horribly racist thing to say Jag. So just because he's white he doesn't deserve any recognition for his hard work over his life? Because he's white and was (i'm guessing) born there he should be fired or removed or what have you just for the sake of hiring someone from India or anywhere else in the world? There's a thing called standards. If a professor is not up to those standards, they don't get hired. That Indian PhD may be a good one, they may know a lot, they may have hundreds of publications, but if they're not up to the desired standards, they don't get hired. Being white has little to do with the issue these days. Everyone is so afraid of being called a racist for not hiring someone that is non-white that it has become a non-issue. It's people like you that perpetuate this nonsense that make it an issue.
For instance: German, Polish, Latvian, (all of WHITE European countries) doctors CANNOT practise medicine in Canada or the United States. They have to get recertified when they get here. They have to take the exams all over again, they have to do their residency all over again, they have to jump through flaming hoops to be doctors here. So please, tell me again how whites from other countries are treated any different than non-whites. Racist.
Joshua
· 1 year ago
That university is run by perverts who are only interested in short term gains & show a great deal of disrespect to the people who donated that land for a specific purpose. Shame on them.
gusma83
· 1 year ago
This is total bull. But brilliant minds always find the way back to the top.
zoesah
· 1 year ago
Yes, I agree that Jag's comments are completely ignorant of the real situation. It seems he harbors prejudice and negativity and just looks for situations to impart his racism. This story has nothing to do with race.
Nick
· 1 year ago
Typical American College.
Look at Art Center College of Design: Deteriorating faculty, facilities, programs....budget cuts everywhere....just to build a new monumental 'research library' that no one wants except for the president, Richard Koshalek, in spote of a 1500+ signature petition.
Rod
· 1 year ago
Please drop the light pollution arguments -- the closure of the DDO has nothing to do with light pollution. The DDO was designed from the beginning for spectroscopy and was still being used by U of T and international astronomers up until last week. This sale is nothing but a cash grab from U of T and (apparently) the Dunlap heirs who stand to gain half of the purchase price. According the the Toronto Star: "Proceeds from the sale will be split between the university and the Dunlap family. According to Steiner, U of T’s portion of the proceeds will be invested entirely in astronomy research and education at the university."
At the moment the Dunlap property is a Mount-Royal-sized park with rolling meadows, forests, natural springs, a pre-confederation heritage home, the largest optical telescope in Canada and a beautiful marble and limestone administration building that was designed by Mather and Haldenby, the architects who designed the original ROM. We are supposed to give this up for condos, monster homes and big box stores?
The DDO sits on the largest remaining green space in southern York Region. Since last October, Richmond Hill Naturalists and others have identified 70 species of birds at the DDO, along with fox, coyote and a small deer herd.
It should be preserved and reborn as a National Museum of Canadian Astronomy. The Observatory can still function as both a working research observatory and as a public astronomy education centre. The much needed green space will serve generations of GTA residents and visitors.
R N
· 1 year ago
It really is a sad picture. Senior professionals should be respected higher than some $$$. Killing someone's career is truly EVIL, especially when the career is built on science and you cannot simply walk to the next block for a new employer.
I hope he'll keep at it, showing the former employer how it could have been done.
Grouch
· 1 year ago
I've been around university politics long enough to know that there's probably a lot more to this story than the picture. I'd like to hear what the other folks have to say.
$100 million is a lot of money, even in big-science. (Big science is like big business, except that we do science.) My guess is that the department and university leaders decided that loosing one faculty member (who was probably doing his best to obstruct their pet projects by clinging to his pet project) was worth it. Rational? Yes. Heartless? Yes. The way the game is played? Also a yes.
I donno what to think. I'd like to hear the whole story. We'd probably decide that they're all a bunch of children squalling over resources, and someone had to loose. So the poor fellow in the picture was chosen. There's probably years of very personal infighting that led to this, and the money finally tipped the scales.
--- Digression ---
Here are some things that everyone should know about academia:
1. The graduate students do all of the work, and get paid the least. But since it's a temporary situation, and since the students learn a lot very quickly, it's beneficial. Credit to where credit is due, and the credit for the elbow grease and the late nights goes to the graduate students.
2. Professors are essentially middle managers. They compete for resources and make sure that their students stay busy. They have a great deal of domain expertise, and they act as mentors to the grad students -- but they are middle managers nonetheless.
3. Even though we're not allowed to make a profit, the economic factors that are part of the human condition still apply. The books just have to show zero profit at the end.
4. The social factors that apply to the rest of the world apply here, as well.
5. All that said, everyone still wants to do good science and enhance the human condition. Personally, I've found the fount of cynicism -- and I'm still motivated to go to work every day by the same curiosity that got me into this business in the first place, and look forward to seeing my work-friends there, too. :-)
majortom1981
· 1 year ago
zoesah its a canadian college not an american one.
solicitor in bulgaria
· 1 year ago
Shame.
rob
· 1 year ago
We had a kerfuffle in NY over the demolition of the Hayden Planetarium. In the end, the land was put back to the same use, with a new facility. Of course, it was an education facility, mostly for kids, not a research tool.
Universities must be good fiduciaries, ie make the maximum use of the wealth they have. I think the wasteful part is when they compete with each other, ie steal faculty or facilities or grants, because that's just one instutiion robbing from another. Since they're all non-profit, they should cooperate on a cross-institutional scale, and many do.
I feel sad for this guy, and don't know enough about astronomy to make a judgement, but IF his facility can be put to better use, it should.
Carl
· 1 year ago
This story has way more to do with Toronto's gentrification and greedy developers than with light pollution. Institutions both public and private all over North America are selling large pieces of land to build condos and shopping centers, and are simply starving the departments of funds and resources in order to come up with reasons to close them.
No neglect is benign
John Taylor
· 1 year ago
I have been to this facility, and looked through this telescope, and met Tom Bolton.
Selling this is simply a money grab. There is no way to excuse it.
"investing the money in the astronomy program" is a cute way of saying it goes into the University operations budget so someone else can get paid.
Had they been actually concerned about light pollution then this telescope would have been moved to a more northern location (middle of Algonquin park?) where it could have been made bigger and better for much less than the $100 million.
This is a sad day for Canada, a sad day for astronomy, and a shameful day for the University of Toronto. All graduates of this school should complain about it degrading the prestige of their degrees.
violet
· 1 year ago
censor me if you must, but what the hell does race have to do with this situation?
All Comments
I guess he should join the International Dark-Sky Association (darksky.org).
Most people have absolutely no idea how much light pollution is really out there. It takes a good old blackout to make it noticeable. Only then do you realise it and wonder about the stupidity of all that light going to waste.
95% OF TEACHER IN TORONTO UNIV ARE WHITE AND 85% OF STUDENTS ARE NON-WHITE, WOW who is to blame, the poor professor who came from india and got a job as a taxi driver or the white teacher club at Toronoto university. Well I am sure that taxi PHd professor became the powerful developer and bought out the university land.
It's also worth noting that the observatory became less useful as the suburban wasteland swallowed it up and lit up the skies with street lamps and shopping malls.
It'll be interesting to follow this story and see where the money ends up being invested...
This guy is an astronomer? If yes, then he should not waste his precious time sitting out there. He could join some associations that can take his talent to high level.
THAT IS THE SADDEST PICTURE EVER
I remember when they "relocated" (removed) the observatory at Tulane University in New Orleans to expand the business school. People with money get away with such stupid things.
"Who knows, it may get too expensive and difficult to send their astronomers to Chile. "
Most of the astronomers I know telecommute for their observations. That's right, most of the time the telescope is being run by people who aren't on site. Granted, I would expect that there is an on site crew and the scientist herself would have to venture down if she wanted to install any custom equipment, but that's pretty rare.
At least that's the impression I get for the big telescopes. The smaller custom rigs (like VERITAS) are probably run slightly differently since they aren't quite as standardized as optical telescopes.
Wow, what a horribly racist thing to say Jag. So just because he's white he doesn't deserve any recognition for his hard work over his life? Because he's white and was (i'm guessing) born there he should be fired or removed or what have you just for the sake of hiring someone from India or anywhere else in the world? There's a thing called standards. If a professor is not up to those standards, they don't get hired. That Indian PhD may be a good one, they may know a lot, they may have hundreds of publications, but if they're not up to the desired standards, they don't get hired. Being white has little to do with the issue these days. Everyone is so afraid of being called a racist for not hiring someone that is non-white that it has become a non-issue. It's people like you that perpetuate this nonsense that make it an issue.
For instance: German, Polish, Latvian, (all of WHITE European countries) doctors CANNOT practise medicine in Canada or the United States. They have to get recertified when they get here. They have to take the exams all over again, they have to do their residency all over again, they have to jump through flaming hoops to be doctors here. So please, tell me again how whites from other countries are treated any different than non-whites. Racist.
That university is run by perverts who are only interested in short term gains & show a great deal of disrespect to the people who donated that land for a specific purpose. Shame on them.
This is total bull. But brilliant minds always find the way back to the top.
Yes, I agree that Jag's comments are completely ignorant of the real situation. It seems he harbors prejudice and negativity and just looks for situations to impart his racism. This story has nothing to do with race.
Typical American College.
Look at Art Center College of Design: Deteriorating faculty, facilities, programs....budget cuts everywhere....just to build a new monumental 'research library' that no one wants except for the president, Richard Koshalek, in spote of a 1500+ signature petition.
Please drop the light pollution arguments -- the closure of the DDO has nothing to do with light pollution. The DDO was designed from the beginning for spectroscopy and was still being used by U of T and international astronomers up until last week. This sale is nothing but a cash grab from U of T and (apparently) the Dunlap heirs who stand to gain half of the purchase price. According the the Toronto Star: "Proceeds from the sale will be split between the university and the Dunlap family. According to Steiner, U of T’s portion of the proceeds will be invested entirely in astronomy research and education at the university."
At the moment the Dunlap property is a Mount-Royal-sized park with rolling meadows, forests, natural springs, a pre-confederation heritage home, the largest optical telescope in Canada and a beautiful marble and limestone administration building that was designed by Mather and Haldenby, the architects who designed the original ROM. We are supposed to give this up for condos, monster homes and big box stores?
The DDO sits on the largest remaining green space in southern York Region. Since last October, Richmond Hill Naturalists and others have identified 70 species of birds at the DDO, along with fox, coyote and a small deer herd.
It should be preserved and reborn as a National Museum of Canadian Astronomy. The Observatory can still function as both a working research observatory and as a public astronomy education centre. The much needed green space will serve generations of GTA residents and visitors.
It really is a sad picture. Senior professionals should be respected higher than some $$$. Killing someone's career is truly EVIL, especially when the career is built on science and you cannot simply walk to the next block for a new employer.
I hope he'll keep at it, showing the former employer how it could have been done.
I've been around university politics long enough to know that there's probably a lot more to this story than the picture. I'd like to hear what the other folks have to say.
$100 million is a lot of money, even in big-science. (Big science is like big business, except that we do science.) My guess is that the department and university leaders decided that loosing one faculty member (who was probably doing his best to obstruct their pet projects by clinging to his pet project) was worth it. Rational? Yes. Heartless? Yes. The way the game is played? Also a yes.
I donno what to think. I'd like to hear the whole story. We'd probably decide that they're all a bunch of children squalling over resources, and someone had to loose. So the poor fellow in the picture was chosen. There's probably years of very personal infighting that led to this, and the money finally tipped the scales.
--- Digression ---
Here are some things that everyone should know about academia:
1. The graduate students do all of the work, and get paid the least. But since it's a temporary situation, and since the students learn a lot very quickly, it's beneficial. Credit to where credit is due, and the credit for the elbow grease and the late nights goes to the graduate students.
2. Professors are essentially middle managers. They compete for resources and make sure that their students stay busy. They have a great deal of domain expertise, and they act as mentors to the grad students -- but they are middle managers nonetheless.
3. Even though we're not allowed to make a profit, the economic factors that are part of the human condition still apply. The books just have to show zero profit at the end.
4. The social factors that apply to the rest of the world apply here, as well.
5. All that said, everyone still wants to do good science and enhance the human condition. Personally, I've found the fount of cynicism -- and I'm still motivated to go to work every day by the same curiosity that got me into this business in the first place, and look forward to seeing my work-friends there, too. :-)
zoesah its a canadian college not an american one.
Shame.
We had a kerfuffle in NY over the demolition of the Hayden Planetarium. In the end, the land was put back to the same use, with a new facility. Of course, it was an education facility, mostly for kids, not a research tool.
Universities must be good fiduciaries, ie make the maximum use of the wealth they have. I think the wasteful part is when they compete with each other, ie steal faculty or facilities or grants, because that's just one instutiion robbing from another. Since they're all non-profit, they should cooperate on a cross-institutional scale, and many do.
I feel sad for this guy, and don't know enough about astronomy to make a judgement, but IF his facility can be put to better use, it should.
This story has way more to do with Toronto's gentrification and greedy developers than with light pollution. Institutions both public and private all over North America are selling large pieces of land to build condos and shopping centers, and are simply starving the departments of funds and resources in order to come up with reasons to close them.
No neglect is benign
I have been to this facility, and looked through this telescope, and met Tom Bolton.
Selling this is simply a money grab. There is no way to excuse it.
"investing the money in the astronomy program" is a cute way of saying it goes into the University operations budget so someone else can get paid.
Had they been actually concerned about light pollution then this telescope would have been moved to a more northern location (middle of Algonquin park?) where it could have been made bigger and better for much less than the $100 million.
This is a sad day for Canada, a sad day for astronomy, and a shameful day for the University of Toronto. All graduates of this school should complain about it degrading the prestige of their degrees.
censor me if you must, but what the hell does race have to do with this situation?